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I have to disagree with you there.
Around the P4 era, when the gigahertz wars were peaking, companies started to back off and realise there are more important things than gigahertz. Technology has continued to advance at an amazing rate, what with quad core’s and i5/i7’s.
Don’t make the mistake of thinking because the chips have a lower number, that they are slower and not as advanced.
We will start to hear more about it towards 2012…but I would be surprised if it comes out that early.
128bit support would make sense if the server versions and consumer versions are based on the same core, as with R2 and 7.
RC,
what the hell does stuck at the 2GHz average mean? We exceeded that years ago, and matured enough to know ‘hertz is not the most important thing when it comes to performance.
When R2 is setup to be a desktop OS, there is no difference in gaming performance between 7.
If anything, 7 would be better optimized for gaming.
Superfetch by design will intefer with more complex games, so if you play a lot of games, disable it.
Simple.
That’s odd, you should not have such issues..
Did you follow the guide in full? Adjust for performance and applications, enable required services etc?
You could try PMing the creator, a user called crskyoem(I think), and see if he will release another version..
RemixedCat,
Those sites do not suck, in the least. They offer dedicated, blindingly fast servers for file downloads, for free. Considering how much I download, they are truly a godsend.
Of course, if there is illegal content and they are notified, they have to remove it, as they are also within the bounds of the law. Also, if no one downloads a file for 6 months it is automatically deleted, but that is not such a bad or unreasonable caveat…
@James97 wrote:
Has anyone who has experience using both Server class operating systems and Client operating systems noticed that Server operating systems tend to be much more system efficient with resources and also have better management of system utilities, system resources, and user profiles?
I have noticed it mostly on a laptop I installed a copy of Server 2008 R2 onto successfully which only has 2GB of memory and by a comparison to Windows 7, work more efficiently now than it ever has.
This is largely due to a difference in the default configuration, and not because of one being more efficient or optimized than the other.
7, being a consumer operating system, tends to take more liberties with resources by default. Which for the most part, is fine. This means there are a lot more services enabled and running, quite a bit of extra functionality, and alltogether more “stuff”.
R2 is quite the oppisite. Being a server OS, it is rarely meant to actually be used as a workstation, and indeed, as little should be running as possible to get the most out of the applications the server will be running.
When both systems are set up in the same configuration, there is little tangible difference. Indeed, there is not much of a technical basis for there being a difference, as 7 and R2 both use the same kerel. This was not the case previously, with win2k3 and R1 both using newer kernels than the consumer predecessor.
Also, don’t be fooled with thinking 7 is bloated or hogging memmory. The way Windows works, it “uses” memory, so that it can assign it to programs as needed. This is expected behavior, and results in an efficient system. Indeed, Superfetch was a refinement and extension of this basic functionality.
The server OS’s do have better functionality for managing profiles and such, but that is expected, if , as is typically the case, you may have thousands of user accounts. For managing your own few user accounts on a local machine, you will find the highest version of 7/vista etc to be equivilant, as it will have access to edit policies.
As for managing resources…there is not so much of a difference in functionality built in, and you can download addonn tools for both operating systems.
A server os is not instantly more efficient and faster, it simply has a different focus and method of doing things, that may or may not suit your needs better than a standard consumer os.
RemixedCat,
Game crashes have absolutely nothing to do with running a server os over 7 or vista, but with your graphics drivers. Likewise, applications and driver stability is not improved by running a server os.
@RemixedCat wrote:
Ok I’m not going to feed your trolling anymore.
How in the world is that trolling?
I provided a technical response, with proof, and all you do is throw around insults?
You have absolutely no idea what you’re talking about, at all.
Grow up.
At the moment, I am getting very frustrated with a poster who does not understand how exceptions work, and believes their own flawed understanding to be correct, despite being presented with authoritative evidence to the contrary!
The discussion is anything but technical, and such behavior is being rewarded at present. The user is anything but technical, and currently holds an ‘expert’ title. It really is not fitting in the least.
I know that we have enough technical users on this site, Arris, JonusC, etc, who could oversee such discussions, and point out when people insist on relying on their flawed understanding, that they are very simply and clearly wrong.
It’s ridiculous for you to assert that you’re being female has anything to do with my attitude towards, you, at all. Instead of responding to the fact that you might be wrong, you just make excused.
“you were not there so you don’t know”, so what? That has nothing to do with anything, and it is naive to think it would. See point 2.
In fact, instead of responding to a single technical point I made, you have called me arrogant, and inferred I am both childish and a sexist. Maybe you should think about how this is amking you look.
I have shown to you, and explained to you why you are wrong, yet you arrogantly persist in believing you are right, and that you know better than the MSDN resource. Do you understand just how arrogant that is?
I could not care less that you are a woman, nor do I argue for the sake of arguing as you suggest.
I argue only on technical points, that’s it. And, in a technical context, you are completely out of place, and so resort to in sults, or trying to sell your personal experiences as facts, when they are anything but.
The problem emphatically does not exist in any form as you describe. A system_service_exception is due to a bad driver or paged pool usage.
Indeed, to quote:
If you still disagree with that, and think that your personal, subjective misinformed experience is somehow more correct and reliable, then please, by all means, provide some sort of verifiable proof, and I will gladly honor my pledge to pay you.
Otherwise, please just admit that you were wrong, and that you are way out of your depth in technical matters. Or, at the least, stop acting childishly and respond to the valid points I make instead of resorting to insults.
@JonusC wrote:
This man needs no introduction, but for the sake of completeness he was the founder of Winternals, Co-Founder of Sysinternals.com, and today works in the Platform and Services Division at Microsoft. He played a vital part in the contruction of the Windows 7 kernel, and in this hour-long video he gets right into the details of the new OS. Seriously, geek porn right here! 😉
Oh – he’s the guy who created Process Monitor by the way – so if you’re half as geeky as me you already love this man
http://channel9.msdn.com/shows/Going%20Deep/Mark-Russinovich-Inside-Windows-7-Redux/
I do indeed love that man!
Nice link!
I just wish the 5th edition of Windows Internals covered Windows 7, and was available as an ebook…
@RemixedCat wrote:
the freakin BSOD said system_service_exception! How many times do I ned to tell you what I saw with my own eyes! holy cow! You are basically telling me what I saw with my own eyes! How hillarious! You crack me up so hard JF!
I am not telling you what you saw with your own eyes. Please stop misrepresenting me, and putting words into my mouth.
You must be very very hard headed to not just agree with me and said I got the bsod and that there needs to be recovery options for those who cannot reformat. plain as that and stop whining about me being wrong when I am the one who experienced this problem.
I am not telling you what you saw with your own eyes. Please stop misrepresenting me, and putting words into my mouth.
I never said you did not get a BSOD. Quote me where I said that? I said you did not understand the reason why you got a BSOD. Quite different.
I am calling this point 1, to avoid having to repeat myself. Instead, I will simply refer to point1.
Point1: You are interpreting the type of exception, system_service_exception, to have an obvious meaning, based on your reasoning of why it occurred. You seem to think that this particular exception is caused by an expected service not running. This is false. An expected service not running would cause a loss of functionality, an error in the logs, or a dependant service not starting. It would not cause a BSOD.You have to let go of your anecdote, and be willing to read and understand the problem, and understand that it has absolutely nothing to do with your interpretation.
were you at my house witnessing this event? Did you personally se my fit of frustration at having to reformat my hard drive to get my OS back up and running becuase I had a BSOD AFTER I REBOOTED AND BEFORE WINDOWS WAS FULLY STARTED UP.
First of all, it is a fallacy that I would need to have been at your. That would have made absolutely no difference. Allow me to clarify and explain why with a second point:
Point 2: In programming, an exception will be an attempt to handle special conditions, that interrupt the otherwise normal flow of a program. These exceptions will be(At least in the case of Windows), well documented, and immutable. They do not always have obvious names, and they are not always reproducible. One important thing to note, is that they are always the same. If you tell someone the type of exception you encountered, then they can simply look at the Microsoft reference page. They don’t need to have been with you to see the exception occur.
You are the densest person I know of. I am not insulting you I am just sick of your assuming that I am dumb and did not exprience this problem just becuase you wasn’t there to witness it. google for system_service_exception BSOD vista and thers tons of people that had that from mixes of everything.
Wow. Back to insults.
But, nevermind that.
Your ignorance is astounding. You remain convinced that your interpretation of what an system_service_exception is, because it was obvious based on the circumstances you believe caused it.
This might have been acceptable, except for the fact I already linked you to the microsoft page explaining exactly what a system_service_exception is.
I have no idea why you think the anecdotes of computer users who don’t know what they are talking about, is more relibale than the official MSDN resource…
I might even cook up a VMware and replicate it. It is easily replicated.
If you can cause a system_service_exception simply by disabling a service, I will gladly pay you $100 USD to any account of your choice.
Otherwise, I would really prefer you to admit you don’t know what your talking about, and that you are wrong, wrong, wrong.
Perhaps JonusC, who has quite a bit of experience with developing could reiterate and confirm what I am saying.
@RemixedCat wrote:
Look: you get the system_service_exception BSOD becuase a require service that needed to start up was NOT running. This was windows update. witch is ran at startup after you install updates.
NO.
That is wrong. Very wrong.
See point 1.
since I had went to the services.msc control panel for the services for windows, I went to it to disable windows update service and set its startup type to “disabled”. I had this done about 2 week prior since it bugged me while I was doing graphics and messed me up a few times. so i did this to disable the nagging icon and baloon tip.
then reboot after applying this change.
Sure, that’s all fine. I’m wondering why you’re not applying or hiding updates, and hope you do actually apply patches…but anyway.
here’s the EXACT STEPS ONE VERY LAST TIME FOR YOU!:
I downloaded Ie8 setup from the MS site
I double cliked my install icon
I went through the first few steps
I accidentally left the option to “install updates” that it gives you as well as installing IE8.
I clicked next and proceeded to the install progress
I had to reboot my computer to complete the IE8 setup (since it requires it to run IE8-If you do not restart you can run IE7 till you do.
I clicked on the restart button
It was showing the green server 2008 pre shutdown screen while showing update progress
It rebooted
It went through the BIOS splash screen and POST messages
It went to the server 2008 animated bar with the black background
Then it BSODed and gave me the system_service_exception error!
OK, sure.
See point 1, and point 2.
It did this becuase the NEEDED WINDOWS UPDATE STARTUP SERVICE WAS NOT RUNNING BECASUE IT WAS DISABLED.
NO
That is not how it works!
See point 1.
Thus it passed the exception error!
See point 2
How hard is this to understand!
I really hope I have explained it well enough for you.
Thanks xxcom9a, I agree completely.
I’m all for keeping technical discussions technical, and thereby constructive.
RC gave an anecdote which is simply incorrect. I explained why, and provided a technical resource to back this up.
Instead, if RC is unable to argue on a technical basis, and resort to insults, I suppose there is really nothing else to say.
@RemixedCat wrote:
You might have never gotten a system_service_exception BSOD so you don’t know
I have, and I do know.
In any event, the technical information trumps your little anecdote.
You will NEVER get a BSOD simply because a service was not running. Nevver. JC, please confirm this.
I have tons of experiences with computers you would only dream of.
So, who is the one making assumptions now?
I’ve actually been working professionally in the industry for the last 15 years, but yes, I’m sure you have far more wideranging experiences from being a graphic designer.
I do very advanced stuff like architecture and 3d modelling, game development and have built over 300 systems from scratch. so don’t tell me what happens and what doesn’t happen
Using specialised programs, and putting PC’s together is not an indication of having technical knowledge of how PC’s, or specific operating systems work.
You can think what you like, but I’m not trolling you, or assuming anything. Going by what you have said on these boards, you have a poor understanding of how the Windows OS works.
You will NEVER get a BSOD because a service is not running. That is simply not what a system_service_exception is. That is a cold hard fact, and I have provided a technical resource to corroborate what I’m saying.
If you disagree, then provide a source other than your anecdote. You know, something reliable.
the problem I had was so obscure becuase most people don’t even bother to mess with the services.msc control panel. go ahead. install IE8 with the windows update service disabled (startup type disabled as well! go to start>run>type “services.msc”) and leave the tick mark on the “install updates” section, have it install the updates, reboot and whoopie you get the BSOD!
No, that does not happen.
If this bug is as reproducible as you claim(assuming it is not specific to your setup), surely there would be a KB article? Have you informed MS? Has no one else ever experienced this bug?
This triggers it becuase since the service is on startup and it needs to still update before windows is loaded all the way it does this becuase the service is not started and the update process depends on it.
No, that is not how it works. You will NEVER get a system_service_exception BSOD simply because a service is not running. Read the page I linked to.
I can’t believe you cannot get this through your little head and then tell me that I am not experiencing that. My tech illiterate mom got this through her head the first time! (since she almost did the same thing I did!)
You’re mum probably just believed what you told her.
If you are getting a system_service_exception, IT IS NOT BECAUSE A SERVICE IS NOT RUNNING.
You need to get over your lack of understanding, admit you’re wrong, learn a bit on the way, and get over it.
Stop spreading misinformation.
Now, how long until you skip over the fact and accuse me of trolling?
@RemixedCat wrote:
Nor was it caused by nvidia driver, as a matter of fact the nvidia driver I had at the time was very stable and nice. Don’t you start on this crap.
I linked you to the page listing the type of crash you encountered, which clearly lists the cause, and suggests graphics drivers could have been at fault. Perhaps graphics were not at fault, but you don’t get a BSOD for the reason you described.
That simply is not how it works. A BSOD because a service is not running? Never.
I had to reformat to get my system back and running.
Well, that may have been easy, but it wasn’t necessary.
Now stop trolling me AGAIN!
Didn’t you learn anything?
I’m not trolling you at all. Sheesh.
Just because I point out how you may have been wrong, or disagree with what you say, is not trolling.
Grow up.
@RemixedCat wrote:
Yesh I do have my partitions spread out like my OS has one, my apps have one my general data has one and my architecture stuff has one. I also have a backup partition exclusivley for linux recovery since it also has memory tools and diagnostics, however it has trouble with NTFS 🙁 but it’s a good distro but Its currently not installed I will install it this winter if They have updated the NTFS tool. I will find the name of it shortly once I get my old favs sorted out.
Which distro? Backtrack?
Why have a seperate recovery partition distro and not just a live cd? The idea behind using recovery software is generally that it is guaranteed to be clean..so it doesn’t make that much sense to have it on the same PC>..practically for home use it doesnt matter though.
Why couldn’t the update software detect the service wasn’t running and say this: “setup could not proceed with updates becuase the service is disabled. Please start the service and try again” kinda things! If this happened it would make this problem history. Self learning systems that know what you do and act accordingly.
The system service exception did not occur because the windows update service was not running…that is not how it works, and would never have caused a BSOD.
It was probably due to your dodgy nvidia drivers(which you mentioned earlier.)
http://msdn.microsoft.com/en-us/library/ms793232.aspx states : “This error has been linked to excessive paged pool usage and may occur due to user-mode graphics drivers crossing over and passing bad data to the kernel code.”
Since it happened while you were gaming, seems like a given.
